—Jordyn
The moment that stayed with me the most was the scene
following Grant getting shot. After the train leaves, Officer Caruso walks over
to his fellow officer and exclaims, “What the fuck happened?”. Then he gets
doing on his knees, grabs Grants hand, and tells him, “Keep your eyes open”.
He also looks frightened, ashamed, and regretful when Grant repeatedly says, “I
have a daughter”. This fascinates me because when I first saw officer Caruso I
thought he was just a mean racist cop. However his subsequent reaction makes me
think otherwise. He is in fact more complicated than one might think.
—Philip
I kept asking myself why I was more upset with the victims
for not complying than I was with the officers for lacking decency. After
hearing this type of story so many times I've started to view police officers
(in these situations) as robots executing commands. I’ve seen it and told
myself “just comply, just comply, just comply” so many times that I get upset
when other don’t, but of course they don’t. They’re people in stressful
situations and they’re not dealing with robots, they’re dealing with people
too. It made me aware to how much I’ve changed my perception of the “boys in blue,”
and just how many times I’ve seen innocent people killed in unnavigable
situations.
—Jordan
The
president laid the groundwork for understanding a crucial aspect of the
reaction to the [Trayvon Martin] verdict. He was asking sympathetic and curious listeners to
consider that the outcry is not about one race’s oppression of another. It’s
about the system of demoralization and dehumanization that sometimes keeps
black people from seeming human even to themselves: epidemiology and statistics
and diagnoses, the pathologization of black existence. The statistics make blacks
look sick and hopeless, weak and unlovable. I’ve seen black women clutch their
purses, too.
It sounds corny. But urgency supersedes that corniness. Oscar Grant is what’s missing from movies about young black men. The movie strives to restore to Grant the individuality that the symbolism of tragedy took away. Coogler’s portrait affixes a human face on ones that hoodies willfully obscure. The film arrives in the moment after the predicted rage turned out to be something a lot stranger and more profound than flashes of fury. No one threw a trash can through a window, as Lee’s character notoriously does in his movie. Sal’s Pizzeria didn’t burn to the ground. Instead of acting up and acting out after the Zimmerman verdict, people began to turn inward, to wring their hands and search their souls. No one knows yet how to break new ground, not even the president. However, there’s a sense that the angry, old solutions will no longer cut it. We might be out of cheeks to turn, but we’re also out of trash cans.
—Wesley Morris
What made me want to tell this story? It started with the
incident, and being right there in the Bay Area when it happened. Being the
same age as Oscar. Oscar was born in 1986. And I couldn’t help seeing myself
right there. Seeing that situation. Seeing his friends—they look like my
friends. We wear the same clothes, the same complexion. So in seeing that I
thought, what if that was me? And that is where the idea initially came from.
Being so hurt and being so angry, and so frustrated, and confused about what
happened. The same feeling everybody had when they were out protesting and
rioting. And people on the other side on the Internet. And seeing the trial, I
feel like it kind of got muddled over that Oscar is a human being. He became
this saint or this idol that people held up. He became a rallying cry and a
symbol for whatever kind of impressions you wanted to make him a symbol for.
And the other side has demonized him. He’s a criminal. He’s a thug. He got what
he deserved. Personally, he’s not either one of those things. I feel like what
was getting glossed over was the fact that this 22-year-old guy didn’t make it
home to the people that he mattered to most. And for unnecessary reasons—his
life was cut short unnecessarily. And so many young black men’s lives get cut
short unnecessarily. [They’re not seen as] human beings by people who don’t
know them or are on the other side of [this particular] conflict who don’t seem
to care.
—Ryan Coogler
OSCAR.
How long yall been married?
PETE.
Eight years.
Oscar nods at this. Pete looks at Oscar's hand for a ring,
doesn't see one.
PETE. You thinking about it?
PETE. You thinking about it?
PETER. What's stopping you?
OSCAR. Money.
PETER. Shitty reason. When we got married, we had nothing. Lived in the back of her parents' house for the first two years.
OSCAR. For real?
PETER. Shit you not ma. I wasn't working at all and she's a teacher, which might as well be the same thing as far as money goes.
OSCAR. How'd you get the ring?
Peter looks around for a beat.
PETER. I stole it.
Oscar looks at him like he is crazy.
PETER. Yeah man, I told you, I had nothing. I used to be good with credit cards if you know what I mean. I wouldn't go that route of I were you man.
OSCAR. Yeah, I'm straight off that.
PETER. Yeah. I ended up getting locked up for a bit. My wife had to sell the ring to bail me out. Got my business going about a year after I got out, and I got her the one she wears now.
OSCAR. What do you do?
PETER. I owe a web design company. We do a lot of business with companies in the valley.
Peter pulls out his wallet and Oscar hands Oscar a card. Oscar looks at it.
OSCAR. Peter? (beat) Oscar.
They shake hands.
1. This is one of the few relatively lengthy scenes between Oscar and a white person in the film (earlier, of course, was his interaction with Katie at the Farmer Joe's where he used to work, where he helps her out with her fish fry—and maybe hits on her just a little). Oscar and Peter have a genuine conversation, the way strangers can, about marriage and commitment. It's a nice exchange between the men—and it is slightly, but significantly—at least I think, different in the film. Look at the clip and look at the screenplay above. First: why this scene in the film—to what effect? Second: to you, what's the significance of the difference between the screenplay and the filmed version?
2. This is hard, I know, but it's quick. This is where Officer Ingram shoots Oscar.
In Coogler's screenplay, it reads this way:
INGRAM. ROLL OVER! ON YOUR STOMACH!!
OSCAR. Fuck, I can't move!
Caruso stands up, pushing off Oscar's head with his hands. Ingram flips [Oscar] off of Carlos' legs and onto his stomach. Oscar squirms again, while Caruso grabs his hand trying to put it behind his back. Caruso puts his knee back down on Oscar, driving down hard at the base of his head, pressing Oscar's face against the ground.
OSCAR. AGHHH, AGHHH!
INGRAM. Fuck. I can't get his hands! Back up.
Caruso lifts up off of Oscar. Ingram stands a but, keeping one knee in Oscar's back, reaches on the right side of his belt and pulls a black gun from the holster. He stands up and aims it at Oscar's back. BLAM!!
[...]
[Oscar's friend] Cato is frozen by shock. Caruso takes a step back, and looks at Ingram with confusion.
The way Coogler films this, from a distance, it all happens quickly and in the middle of chaos. Still: look at the minute plus clip. Why did this happen? And does any part of what Jordyn, Philip, and/or Jordan say at the top of the page apply to why you saw this happen?
3. Finally, something from Thrower's class playbook. I would like you to acknowledge one of your classmates for something they did this semester or year that you appreciated or learned from or enjoyed or helped make the class better. Something you would feel comfortable acknowledging and thanking a classmate for.
3. Finally, something from Thrower's class playbook. I would like you to acknowledge one of your classmates for something they did this semester or year that you appreciated or learned from or enjoyed or helped make the class better. Something you would feel comfortable acknowledging and thanking a classmate for.
And that's it everyone. Thank you all for the time, effort, thought, and feeling you put into this blog this year. Reading them was always a highlight of my day and/or night. Really.
I think part of the reason this scene was included in the film relates to the idea we talked about in class about no singular “black experience”. Coogler creates a white character who can empathize with Oscar. Both share a common experience and Peter even warns Oscar about the dangers of following a certain lifestyle. By doing this Coogler shows that white and black people can all experience the same things. Anybody can steal, get a job, and have a happy relationship. The main differences I spot are the two lines that get cut out about Peter living in his parent's basement and Peter going to jail along with the added line of Peter offering to help Oscar. To me, the added line is most significant because it shows that Peter learned from his mistakes and is willing to help out someone who could make similar mistakes. Peter doesn’t care that Oscars black and in a way their common struggle unites them. I also think that Oscars openness about his money problem along with his acceptance of the charitable act shows that he’s willing to set aside his pride for an opportunity to get a job and help his wife and daughter.
ReplyDeleteI definitely agree with Jordan’s point about these people being in an extremely stressful situation. I also at first felt like all Oscar and his friends and the police had to do was just calm down, comply, etc. However, I don't think this was entirely possible because of the cops and Oscar/his friends attitudes, the screaming passengers, and the general commotion. There was no instance for the situation to de-escalate and that’s part of the reason why I think what happened happened.
I’d like to thank two people: Yani and John. I think both of you presented thought provoking and intelligent points/ideas throughout the year. I especially enjoyed days when you two would have conflicting opinions because it prompted me to look into the issues we discussed more closely and also spiced up the discussion. It was also, if I’m being completely honest, kinda funny oftentimes.
I think this scene shows (again) Oscar’s good heart, but also that Oscar is not a “scary black guy.” Pete, a white guy, feels comfortable with him enough to share that he stole the ring, but I am also wondering if he would have shared the same information with, for example, a well-off white man (I think not, but not sure.) The screenplay mentions Pete looking around before saying he stole the ring, but he looks much more comfortable with Oscar in the clip, which I think makes the scene in the film feel much more pleasant. Overall, I think the clip has a more optimistic note than the screenplay, which on the first read, appears less personable and more desperate, rather than the New Year’s encounter that it was.
ReplyDeleteI am sorry John, but I cannot watch it again. BUT to Jordan’s point, the fact that I am always a little angry at people for not reacting appropriately in stressful situations, specifically in police brutality cases, has crossed my mind but I have never been able to fully think it out. You (@Jordan) are so right! I am angry that someone did not passively just let the cop bully them around, but I have never fully been able to logically conceive of the fact that I would have even less control in a similar situation. It is much easier to critique something than to actually live through (if you’re lucky in this case) a moment for yourself. Now I feel guilty for being angry about that, but I know that thought will continue to present itself every time I hear of a case like this, and I will have to work on that.
I want to thank Andrew for having such opposing views to mine because what would a lit class be without opposing perspectives and opinions. Although we (gladly) did not get into any arguments, I am glad that I could challenge myself with your opinions that are very different from my own. And also thank you to Zoya for being so supportive of everyone and for being a class cheerleader for great ideas and for encouragement!
ReplyDelete1. I believe that this scene was included in order to set up the devastation that Oscar’s death gives us. This was a conversation where two men talked about their futures; however, unbeknownst to Oscar, he has no future. He cannot reminisce about marrying his girlfriend and continuing to provide for and enjoy his family. He was even given information about a web design job, which is another opportunity that he will never be allowed to pursue. The difference, while minuscule, is that Peter’s wife had to sell her ring in order to get Peter out of jail in the screenplay. Taking away this detail in the film made me assume that Coogler wanted to suppress the notion that life can be unfortunate and cruel. People who watch this scene just see that Peter’s wife acquired a stolen ring and gets to keep it with no consequences. However, as we are shown in the film, Oscar has no chance to escape his unjust death.
2. I agree with Jordyn, who says that the film showcases “a much more modern form of racism”: one that “is not as obvious and can even be labeled an accident.” When I look at the clip again, I see two white men pushing a handcuffed black man into the ground and screaming at him for feigning resistance. I see a father who will never see his daughter again, a lover who will never see his girlfriend again, and a son who will never see his mother again. This situation occurred because of a racist and ignorant narrative that has been reinforced for generations. And sadly, it is influential enough to convince others to remove the humane qualities of a person and, instead, visualize them as unintelligible creatures. Those police officers shot Oscar to silence him, not to protect the peace as their job title demands them to do.
3. I really appreciate Christian’s personality in his posts. One of the best examples of this came from one of the “Do the Right Thing” blogs. He describes Radio Raheem as a black guy with good taste in music. In this class, there were a lot of heavy topics and gut-wrenching.y tragic situations that we had to sift through; so, in my opinion, it was good to go into these talks with a bit of lightheartedness. Thank you for that, Christian; never change.
1. This scene, along with the one with Katie, does multiple things without pushing a particular agenda. Oscar is obviously humanized in both, by being genuinely kind to complete strangers. But this scene highlights truths our society often gleams over. Black men can often be depicted as a menace for theft, shoplifting, or (in Oscar’s case), selling drugs. Regardless of realistic motives (money for child support, food, or basic needs), there begins to be a negative disposition when thinking of said crimes, and a picture can be made of it typically being a Black male. Here, Coogler shows struggles are not specific to one race, and because of that crimes aren’t either. So, the scene effectively shows stereotypes mean nothing, as no one expected Peter to have stolen, and no one at first glance would see the pure heart Oscar has. Second, it does the opposite of the riot of “Do the Right Thing”, in that it shows a positive relationship between two different races, where it simply doesn’t matter.
ReplyDeleteShowing the shooting scene in that pace and perspective really showed how quick things can escalate. We were whisked away in the chaos just as Oscar was, so it was surely understandable how there was a lack of compliance. So, I definetly think Jordan is right in that aspect.
I want to thank Isaac for diverging in class when there is a perspective or idea that’s completely been unexplored/neglected. Of course, I want to thank John for this experience of a class, and also everyone who simply voices there opinions. Our conversations really sharpen a thorough analysis, and disagreeing is critical to that progression. So thanks to everyone for supporting their own beliefs and perspectives in a respectful and thoughtful way!
1. I think this clip was included first of all because it highlights Oscar’s personable like-ability as he is able to make a connection with someone very different than anyone we had seen him interact with in the film so far. It also showed his ability to make connections and find empathy between the two of them as Peter shares a very personal to Oscar, obviously trusting him in this moment. I think the difference I see from the screenplay and the clip is only the difference of a few lines but it feels like a more genuine connection than the lines gave. For example, Peter encouraging to reach out if he ever needed anything and their genuine “nice to meet you exchange” that is shared at the end of their interaction. These slight changes build a stronger connection between the two and add a sense of kindness from both ends.
ReplyDelete2. I think it’s really powerful that the clip starts with Oscar stating their innocence and defending he and his friend’s honors. After this the police get more aggressive and so do Oscar in his friends. In this moment we see Oscar sensing that this is dangerous territory as he encouraged his friends to calm down saying they were just trying to get home. This goes along with Jordan’s point about compliance and this dynamic between the officers and Oscar. I think the distance from the shot and the following silence exemplifies to make a contrast between how much the tension was building and how fast this irreversible, life ending gunshot happened.
3. I would like to shout out Jordan for always bringing a well thought out and well worded point to the table. Id also like to shout out his reading voice that made reading out loud feel like a live action rendition.
1. I think one thing that is apparent in both these dialogues is how similar these two men are. They both have gotten caught up in some legal trouble and have been in a tough place. I think this conversation shows that there are similarities between everyone. This man who you wouldn’t think to have so much in common with Oscar turns out to. I also think it’s important that they connect on this basis of not only love, but a future. I do think there is a significant difference in the screenplay and the actual film in that in the screenplay, Peter ends up going to jail for a bit but in the movie it’s not mentioned. If seems like there’s almost more casualty in the screenplay conversation.
ReplyDelete2. I think the way that this is shot is very different than how it reads. When watching the movie, I can’t hear the officer say “ I can't get his hands! Back up” and I feel like by making that not clear in the movie, it’s easy to call that human error. Yes it’s very upsetting, but it’s easy to say it’s an accident where as in the screenplay it’s not. I think I agree with Phillip because after watching this whole movie I emphasize with Oscar and then you get this one snapshot of this cops life and it’s very easy to flatten him as well.
3. I want to thank Regan because I feel like she always brings amazing new points to the table and she seems to always have a new perspective. I have a lot of respect for the way that she fleshes out her points and really makes sense every time she says something(this might not seem like a big thing but it is). Also thank you to you John!
The main difference is the Pete in the movie didn’t mention that he went to prison or that his wife had to sell the original ring to pay for his bail. I think this difference is signifiant because it didnt establish a spesific connection between the men: in this case having been in jail at some point. I think the screenplay did a better job connecting the two characters more closely. The fact that the stolen ring was used to pay for his bail is significant to me. It shows how a mistake was used to pay for a second chance at life, and it worked out for Pete. This ties in to Oscars second chance at life after he got out of jail. Until his second chance was stolen from him when he got shot.
ReplyDeleteI agree with what was said up top. The cop was more human rather than just a robot and that made the whole exchange even more tragic. The line “I have a daughter” is just hard to stomach. I think this happened because of fear. Fear of losing control and fear of black people from the cops. I think that we see a very complicated situation turn tragic quick. That’s really realistic.
I wanted to call out Jacob. Jacob has been a great voice in class and has been a good anchor. Whenever we stray off topic for too long, Jacob has been there to drag us back onto the rails. I also think he asks good questions to the class to help us get started in discussion.
1. I think that this scene exists in the movie for several reasons. Firstly, and perhaps most importantly, I think it is there to acknowledge the tremendous power of human connection that can occur in purely random situations such as that, especially with strangers. The way they are so easily able to strike up a nice conversation such as that is beautiful, especially predicated on the fact that Oscar just helped this guy out in such a kindhearted selfless manner. I also think the scene is in there to prove the ability of white and black people to get along when their own pre-suppositions about each other are put to rest and they are able to just have frank conversation as humans about their common experience. I think that the last reason this scene is in the movie is to also challenge our own pre-suppositions about white people here and their perceived innocence in relation to black people and to consider that this guy has participated in white-collar crime and is just as much if not more of a criminal than Oscar is. It's interesting for us to see that for this guy to get where he is, married happily for 8 years, kid on the way, leading a successful small business, he had to turn to crime too, and that's just not the first thing people think of when they think of successful white people in America.
ReplyDelete2. This is the one scene in the movie that honestly left me speechless and I have no good answer as to why this happened. I thought it was shot beautifully and moved from angle to angle flawlessly to convey the chaos and terror of the whole situation. I thought that the escalation from the bald white cop when they were on the wall was the turning point of the scene for me when I began to vilify the cops. The very end part right up to where he gets shot just played out so oddly for me, it felt as if he got up and shot him provoked by nothing and it didn't make sense to me at all. But I guess no one can truly know what goes through the head of someone like that in a situation like that, the best we can do is assign blame to some twisted concoction of racial prejudices, fear and even malice that makes for a momentary judgment call as truly tragic as that one.
3. I would like to acknowledge Jordyn right back for her tremendous contributions to the class as well. I always see her voice as that of someone who has that perfect mixture of extremely well put together and sound arguments, while also maintaining the clear passion and immediacy of someone who obviously cares so much about the subject matters we are discussing. She is never afraid to voice her opinion, and while it often differs from my own, it is extremely reassuring to me to see someone so intelligent and thoughtful make me consider my own views from a different light, thank you :)
This scene is a really interesting one because these two people who seem to come from completely different worlds are able to form a really nice connection over a quick conversation. It is significant because it is clear that Peter is in the same situation Oscar was in a few years before, and it shows Oscar that it is possible for him to move up in the world. The major difference between them is that Peter is white, so even though he went to prison (not mentioned in movie) that does not hold him back, where it probably will hold Oscar back. Peter will also not have the systemic issues, including dealing with police brutality, that Oscar has to deal with. I think the reason that the fact that Peter went to prison was not mentioned is because realistically a white person commiting a white collar crime would not really carry with them, where as a low level non violent drug offense will stay with people of color for the rest of their lives. Even though there is really no difference between Peter and Oscars crimes, since they were both not physically hurting people and trying to support their families, it shows the hypocrisy in the justice system that.
ReplyDeleteI do not know why it happened. Maybe it was a racist cop who wanted to kill a man, maybe it was a mistake. An argument can be made that if he and his friends had just not said a word and completely complied, he would have been alive. That would be an easy argument for me to say as a white person who the cops would not have pulled off the train in the first place. At a certain point people are gonna stand up for their self dignity, even if it is not in their best interest. Overall, the reason I think it happened was because of the tension between the justice system and the black community built over 100’s of years of oppression.
I want to call out Philip and Jacob. Phillip, you have given really thoughtful comments all year in class and on the blog, and I love how you always keep an open mind and are open to changing your opinion. You have also been really respectful during debates. Jacob, I feel like you came into the class not knowing too much about a lot of the topics we have discussed, but you always paid attention, grappled with the issues intelligently, and kept an open mind in class. Because of this, it seems like you have learned a ton this year and have grown a lot as a student.
I think this scene was include to show the genuine side of Oscars personality. It gives to a better representation of oscar and it true self. It reminds me of the quote from Atticus about not judging someone by their race, gender, economics. Oscar does a very kind act, but connects very well with Pete, and portrays how good oscar can be. Although he was innocent this scene sets us up to have stronger emotions in the future scenes. His act of kindness isn’t huge but it's something that the couple may remember for a long time, but to oscar seems small. Watching this scene I honestly didn't think about race all i could think of was how kind oscar was being. Knowing his future.
ReplyDeleteI agree with jordyn that this film is just a more modern version of racism: it is not as obvious and can even be labeled as an accident. When the cop first shoots oscar every other cop looks at him with confusion, but they are of course going to back him up at the end of the day. They will say its an accident. Oscar yelling to the cops saying they were innocent and defending his friends only provokes the cops more but if one cop does something the rest follow. The silence following the shooting is very powerful, and shows the reaction between the building, the cops, and oscars friends.
I would like to thank Jacobi for always being so willing to read and bring in such interesting points to the table. He always has something to say that sparks a conversation whether we agree or not. Even if he doesn't fully agree questions or arguments he always takes a shot and doesn't look back.
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ReplyDeleteThe scene between Oscar and Peter gave even more dimension to Oscar as a character. Both of these men are looking out for the women they love, they can empathize with this. These two men appear very different, but when they get ot talking they realize they have much in common. Peter admits he stole the ring for his wife and recognizing that Oscar is a black man, recommends that he does not do the same. These men have things in common but Coogler also shows us just how different their experiences will be in society. Oscar will have to be more careful than Peter, a white man, had to be in the same position.
ReplyDeleteI agree with Jordyn in wanting everyone to just comply. I know this is unrealistic given the circumstances and the chaos. This scene is difficult to watch and also difficult to try to keep track of everyone's movement and who did what. The way Coogler films it is very similar to the way it would have been filmed from a mobile phone. I’m sure this was deliberate. Also everything happened so quickly, in just a matter of seconds it gets completely out of hand, and Oscar gets shot. Something that's stuck with me is Oscar’s attempt to pacify his friends, reminding them that they haven't done anything illegal and they just need to get cited and go home. I don't fully understand why it escalated to the extent that it did.
Marie did a really good job this semester of stepping back from all of the little details and commenting on the big picture. It’s easy to get stuck focusing on all the little things but it is also important to understand how they fit together to form the bigger picture. Often times Marie would respond to something I said in class, zooming it out and showing the wider view. Thank you Marie for helping me step back.
1. I think that this scene really shows the human in both Oscar and Pete. Oscar is talking about wanting to get married and Pete talks about how he struggled a while back, like many of us do. I also think the fact that oscar talked about marriage makes the ending of the movie even harder because we had an idea of his future and it got taken away. I think it also shows how different Pete is from the cops. Aside from the cops and Katie, Pete is the only white person really that we see oscar come into contact with and I think it was there to show us that not everyone thinks the same and that everyone is so different. I really liked Pete and the scene he shared with oscar, it made me feel happy despite the fact that I knew he was going to die.
ReplyDelete2. I can't really tell you why this happened, because at the end of the day I am not the police officer who shot Oscar. I do agree with wat Jordan said above. I found it very frustrating as a viewer to see oscar and his friends not listening to the police. It was almost hard to look at the scene because I knew what was going to happen and I didn't want to watch but also a tiny part of me felt hope that they would be okay. I agree that police officers (then and now) are trained very thoroughly to follow a specific set of rules and are in a way, programmed people. I think at the end of the day it happened because oscar wasn't listening and they needed him to be compliant.
3. I really want to thank Claire for everything she has done this year. Even though she's a year younger than me I've always looked up to her in this class. She's always very active and on top of the assignments and isn't ever afraid to push limits and say what she thinks. I feel like she makes very good points during discussions and is really good at tying things together nicely. I admire her so much for that! Thank you Claire :) I also want to thank Isaac for always volunteering to read and for bringing his own perspective to discussions. I could easily say that I've learned a thing or two from you Isaac! And John i want to thank you as well for making all of this happen! It's been an amazing year.
I think this scene was included because it shows that Oscar can relate to people who seem so different from him, but in the grand scheme of things aren't that different at all. Looking at the movie as a whole, this scene really says a lot because while Peter had the opportunity to learn, and fix his mistakes, Oscar's life was taken from him before he got that chance. It is interesting how the film leaves out the part about Peter going to jail because that is something else that Oscar can relate to. It really shows the parallel between the two characters and how their lives turned out so differently sole because of their races.
ReplyDeleteI think that this happened because of the pure chaos that was going on from all directions. I agree with what Jordan said about wanting Oscar and his friends to comply but also how it is not that simple. Leading up to the gunshot, the police officers were unnecessarily doing everything they could to keep the power in their hands. When that shot went off, I think the human in them came out especially because of Oscar's comments. The screenplay reads very differently from what I saw in the clip, and I do think it was a tragic accident yet completely avoidable at the same time.
I want to shout out Claire for always bringing to points and topics to the table. She was never afraid to say what she thought, and I really appreciated and enjoyed listening to her formulate her ideas out loud so the class could think along with her. I also think she did a greta job building off of other peoples opinions.
I think this scene was put into the movie to kind of go against the stereotype that black men are intimidating towards white men. Peter appears the be happy to be hanging out with Oscar and vice versa. I also think it is interesting that they had Peter be an ex-felon as well. I think this sort of speaks to the fact that white people can do bad things and it is unjust for cops or anyone to assume criminals are all black. I think leaving out the detail about his wife having to sell the ring to get her husband out of jail sort of makes the impact that no one really goes through life without hardships and there is a common ground between all people of any race.
ReplyDeleteI agree with jordyn that this showed a much more modern style of racism. There were no racist rants or racial slurs used over and over again, yet in a way it almost makes it worse. It is clear, yet it is also difficult to pinpoint the exact reasoning behind the cops. It also makes the scene worse because Oscar was the one who kept telling his friends that they would be ok and to just stay cool, even though they hadn’t done anything wrong. I don’t think there is a good reason as to why this happened, because it really should have never happened, but i believe that it stemmed from the cops making bad assumptions and then getting caught up in their head about the malintent of Oscar and his friends.
I would like to thank Jane. She was a quiet participant in class, but when she had comments they always kind of left my mind blown. Jane always looked at things in a slightly deeper and different way than others, and I think this helped the class break out from cycling debates sometimes. She was also not afraid to kind of speak against the majority and usually she provided a better example than those she thought differently from. I also spent most of the year looking at her art from Darktown on the wall and it was really good so definitely nice thing to see on the wall. Thanks Jane!
The moment between Oscar and Peter contributes to the film in a few possible ways. Most obviously the connection made between the two men builds upon the idea that Oscar is a sociable and popular guy; he is easy to be friends with because he is inclined to be natured. It makes Oscar seem a little more innocent and therefore more endearing to the audience. Another way this moment contributes to the film is that it modernizes the idea that we have been studying about the “black experience” in America. The audience, and Oscar for that matter, don’t expect to learn that Peter, a white man with a pregnant wife, is a former criminal. However, experiencing the parallel between he and Oscar’s stories forces us to recognize their shared humanity instead of their differences. The deleted part when peter explains that he went to prison is significant because it supports the idea that specific demographics don’t always bind us to realities and that humanity ties us together.
ReplyDeleteI agree with what Philip said about this scene. You can’t really blame any specific person here because of the impact that history and other outside elements have had on these power dynamics. I’m trying to find a way to express this without sounding like I think the police were in the right, but people dealing with people in a high stress situation does not create cohesive environments or relationships. Blaming history is not the solution to the problems addressed in this film, but is important to acknowledge before we move forward
I really appreciate Ellie for having such thoughtful and composed responses during discussions. She seems to articulate how she feels about topics in class in thorough and meaningful ways with which I feel like I am always able to agree. I especially respect her ability to verbalize her thoughts when she doesn't necessarily have a polished opinion. One time during a Do The Right Thing discussion I remember her saying “I’m uncomfortable with this but I’m not quite sure why.” This skill is something that I struggle with and aspire to be able to do and having an example to hear from in class is very helpful.
1. I think there are a few advantages to having this scene in the film. First, it presents an open door for Oscar that he’ll unfortunately never get to step through. It’s yet another way for the film to tug on our heartstrings. The second, however, is to portray that in a way Oscar isn’t alone. There are other people who’ve struggled, had ups and downs, and even hit incredible lows. Peter and Oscar are able to make a connection over this. I think the reason that the film version allows Peter to get away with his crime is because it establishes a contrast to Oscar. Peter was able to commit a real crime and escape not only without any repercussions, but better off for it. In about 10 minutes, Oscar will lose his life for nothing, having done virtually nothing wrong. It’s no surprise either that Peter is white. Ryan Coogler is, without beating us over the head, reminding us that this is still the world we live in.
ReplyDelete2. I think I agree with what Jordan said. That guy seems to know what he’s talking about. Really though, I think this happened because of a multitude of factors that can’t really be explained away in just a few words. I think of the mood of the officers, working at 2 am on New Year’s Eve, having just responded to a similar call involving an armed person. I think of the rush of power the officers felt in that moment, knowing they dominated the situation and Oscar was helpless. I think of the racial bias the officers likely had within them. I think of the pressure from the onlooking crowd. I think of Oscar and his friend’s various degrees of resistance to the officers’ demands. I think of the fact that the two probably weren’t qualified for the high-stress situation, and the problem of needing to assign people to job’s above their qualifications. Could the shooting have been prevented? Probably. But there are so many factors involved that it’s difficult to just point at one and assign blame to it. Like most situations, it’s much more complicated that it appears on the surface.
3. I want to give a shoutout to Isaac for often being able to present a different way of looking at things, and challenging the class discussion with opposing ideas. When these kinds of comments are thrown into a discussion, everyone is forced us to really rethink their own positions and consider new information. Class conversations are elevated by this type of comment, and Isaac seemed to have plenty of them up his sleeve to raise the discussions to another level.
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ReplyDeleteI agree with Jacobi when he says that this is all part of the emotional build up that makes Oscar’s death so much more devastating. We listen to this conversation, Oscar talking about his future, all while we know that he is not going to have his future. We can tell that he is looking towards marriage and looking to make his family even stronger. I do think that the difference between the screenplay and the film is significant. In the movie, we feel this connection between Oscar and Pete because of when Pete says, he too started with absolutely nothing when he started dating his girlfriend. But in the screen play, it takes it too a whole new level when he says that he also went to prison for trying to do something to make people that he loves happy. If we are right about why Oscar went to prison, he was not trying to sell weed for selfish reason. But instead he most likely was selling in order to make money to feed and house his family, even if it was illegal.
ReplyDeleteI think that this made Oscar’s death much more suspenseful and heartbreaking. Instead of having him be shot in a dramatic far away shot, this scene was much more heartbreaking. I didn’t necessarily sense that he was about to be shot, and when he did they zoomed into his eyes and we saw him slowly lose his consciousness. I think this also brings into question the intention of the police officer. I think it makes it more difficult to argue that the police officer purposely killed Oscar when it happens in a close and personal fight on the ground.
I agree with Jordyn when she says that this is a more modern type of racism, because of how many different sides and perspectives that could be taken towards this issue. Even though people may disagree with me, I can’t see this death as a cold blooded murder. The police officer is in the wrong and Oscar is the victim in this situation, but you can tell in his words and facial expressions when Oscar says “I have daughter”, that he was completely broken. I don’t think he wanted to kill Oscar.
I want to shout out Jon Schulder for our one class where he amazed the class with his perfect John Capute impressions. He really does John almost as well as John does John. It’s always refreshing to have some humor on a Friday at 6th period.
I think that they added this scene to the film to show how real and relatable Oscar is. A white man can think the same way that he thinks and can feel the same way that he feels. It also shows how Oscar is just a regular guy. He’s not dangerous and definitely did not deserve to be shot. I think this scene can also give Oscar hope when it comes to his future (though it may be false hope). Since this guy got through his troubles then why wouldn’t Oscar? Obviously, Oscar doesn’t get the chance to see what his future would look like which really shows the true difference between them. This white man got a chance, but Oscar, a black man, does not.
ReplyDeleteI think what happened in that scene was just a bunch of chaos. There was a lot of yelling, and I don’t think anyone really knew what was going on. Like Phillip said, Officer Caruso’s behavior was very interesting to me. Though he was being an asshole before, he did not want Oscar dead. It was obvious. He didn’t seem that racist afterwords; he seemed more like he was just doing his job. I also agree with Jordan because the men were not acting how, I would think, people should act around police.
I want to thank Jon for always have really intense debates with Yani and John. He always keeps the conversation moving. I really appreciate it. His humor is also really great when I’m really tired.
1. I think this scene serves a juxtaposition of the infamous police scene later on. Based on Peter’s appearance and the film’s main themes, one would assume that Peter would feel uneasy around Oscar because Oscar is black. However, he isn’t uneasy. He starts a conversation with Oscar and genuinely wants to get to know him. This juxtaposes the police where the police couldn’t care less about Oscar’s backstory or aspirations. They see a black man, and they instantly think he’s a thug that deserves to be brutalized. For me, the main difference between the script and the film is the jail part. I believe the movie hints at, I know I’m going to say it, white privilege. Peter was able to steal an engagement ring and get away with it. That is something Oscar could never do solely based on his appearance. However, it’s not forced and wants to make the audience feel about white privilege. It’s more of a reminder that it exists.
ReplyDelete2. Jordan’s point is spot on. There are too many times in movies about police brutality where I want the characters to comply with the officers: not because I want the system to be in power, but I just want these characters to live. These thoughts occurred to me when I watched the movie Detroit, where these black characters were essentially being held hostage by white police officers. I wanted them to get through the night. I wanted them to survive, so therefore, I would get extremely upset when they didn’t comply. However, I always come to the realization that these are people. They make mistakes and they do not always think rationally when put in these situations. I wouldn’t think rationally, so I can’t be hard on them for simply acting on human instinct.
3. I want to thank Isaac for alway asking the thought provoking questions, the questions that no one ever asked. His questions often made people ponder and get stirred up. That is something that I appreciate because it started conversation about really intelligent topics. Thank you for that Isaac.
1. Like I said in the last blog, this scene adds a lot in terms of contrasting/commenting on race in America. This is the one and only true conversation we have between two people of different races, and as such we must pay close attention to what Ryan Coogler wants us to take away from such a pivotal scene. The moral of this scene to me is that we are not as different as we think we are. I think the difference is mainly because when they got on set to film it and were saying the dialogue out loud it felt so expository and unnatural. It’s hard to tell how a film will feel from a script, but once Ryan realized the blunt exposition didn’t fit the style of the film he probably cut it.
ReplyDelete2. Why? Firstly, I think Ryan Coogler wants us coming away from this movie asking that exact question If he provided a clear answer he wouldn’t be doing reality justice. I also think the entire point of the film is there is no real answer. Sure you could say “racism” and be done with it, but if you look at the specific situation it still seems completely random and meaningless.
3. I would like to shoutout Jordan James for his sincere comments and amazing accents, Andrew for his provoking and thoughtful intensity, and Jordyn for her happy energy that she brings to class :)
I think this scene shows the contrast between the white experience and black experience with the law. In the film, Peter never got caught. He was given a chance to start over. One may look at Peter and think, “Well, he screwed up, but he was given a second chance and he restarted his life.” We would view him as a good guy that did a bad thing. But if Oscar were to do that, he would not be viewed in the same way at all. I mean, he literally got murdered for doing nothing. His life got taken away for nothing. He wouldn’t be given that second chance in the same way that Peter was given that chance. This was a clear example of white privilege.
ReplyDeleteThe difference between the screenplay and the filmed version was that in the screenplay, Peter got punished for his wrongdoing. He got sent to jail and was released and then started over. In the film, on the other hand, he did not get punished. He simply got away with it and started over. The film shows that since Peter was white, he wasn’t punished in the way a black person would be. It highlights society’s perception of each of the two races.
This happened because the officers wanted to prove their authority to the black people. Everyone knows you can’t arrest people for no reason, but he did it anyway to show his power. For the white officer, it was a contest of power. For Oscar, it was his record, his dignity, his life on the line. It was just a back and forth and each time Oscar or one of his friends said something, the officer took the screaming match up a notch.
Replying to what Jordan said, I think that whenever I see movies about police brutality or just black people dealing with law enforcement in general, I always think the same thing too. I think, “Why can’t they just keep their heads in the car or why can’t they just keep their hands on the roof instead of moving them?” The reason why I thought that was because if they move or resist, the cop has somewhat of a reason to get the black person in trouble: talking back to law enforcement and not complying. After what Jordan said in class today and from his comment, I realized, “You’re right, no, they aren’t robots.” They just get frustrated the same way anyone else would when you insult them or abuse them. They are human too. And I think that’s the problem. Even with the situation with Peter, he is seen as more than one thing: a guy that did some illegal things, screwed up, and wants to redeem himself. Oscar, and all black people on the other hand, is viewed as only one thing: a threat, a thug, a criminal. Oscar doesn’t get a chance to redeem himself. But after all, they are both human, and the fault is that even though they are equals, they are not seen in the same way. .
Jordyn, thank you so much for being so sweet and amazing. I really value your perspectives in class because you always have something interesting and insightful to say.
Also, Jordan, I love your accents when we read out loud. It makes reading so much better.
Also, Isaac, you have such a unique perspectives and you always address the aspects of the work that I didn’t even think about. A great way of thinking.
And, of course, John. Thank you so much. It was an honor having you as my teacher this year. You really helped me improve on my writing; I have made such a jump from that 8 page Million Dollar Baby essay to the papers I write today. Thank you
1. I think that this scene was included in the film to both build Oscar’s character and additionally as a contrast or comparison to Oscar’s experiences. I know that it may not be the aim of the scene but after rewatching the clip, the white guy originally came of as obnoxious. Something about his voice and the way his question came off as less of a question than, in comparison, Oscar asking if the store had a bathroom originally. But after the silence between them was broken a pleasantly surprising friendliness between strangers emerged in their conversation. By this point in the film, I wasn’t thinking about the clip from the beginning and honestly it was a moment of hope as Peter handed Oscar his card. I was happy for him and thought that there was a chance that Oscar could get back on his feet. In terms of the differences in the film and the screenplay, I think that including the bit about Peter going to jail and quickly getting bailed out and getting his business up and running only a year later would have made this interaction less hopeful. This makes the comparison between Oscar and Peter’s situations almost too close while also highlighting the fact that Peter found a way out and is now much better off whereas Oscar has just been fired for a thing as small as being late too many times.
ReplyDelete2. Why did this happen? It certainly didn’t need to. Oscar ran into a former rival from prison and rightfully felt threatened, after all, it seemed they had a violent history and Oscar’s friends and girlfriend were not too far behind him. Even though he didn’t throw the first punch, Oscar was pulled off that train while the man who punched him (wearing a bright red baseball cap) went untouched. There were so many avoidable mistakes that happened in such a short time that this was very difficult to watch happen. I think this ties into what Jordan was saying about how it showed the real difficulty to recognize these mistakes in a scenario like this. However, these men are relatively drunk and have just seen their friend (Oscar) threatened and punched by a former rival and they are definitely not the only ones making errors in their behavior and I find their actions far more understandable than those of the angry cop originally. He slammed someone to the ground with an audible crack who was not putting up a fight and also was incredibly racist towards Oscar. But then again, as Philip pointed out, you can’t help but second guess yourself when the same cop tries to comfort Oscar in pain.
3. I would like to acknowledge Jane for her insightful comments in class discussions. In particular, during a discussion about “To Kill a Mockingbird” she was talking about the way that Mayella might be processing what’s happening to her or reacting because of her abusive father. Jane’s points and insight on the topic really gave the discussion a fairer view of Mayella’s character and her situation. It certainly changed the way that I viewed her actions and gave more complexity to the discussion of "To Kill a Mockingbird".
Oscar’s scene with Peter is a way for the viewer to see Oscar as more of a human than a drug dealer or former prisoner. Peter talks about how he had nothing when he married his wife, but that they built a life together. This is a subtle way for Ryan Coogler to insinuate that Oscar could get his crap together and make a better life for Sophina and their daughter. Also, Peter gives away information that isn’t exactly in his best interest to ever give away or bring up: he lead a credit card scam. This kinda makes hm and Oscar seem like more of the same person even though they are of different races. I think that they made a great creative decision to not mention that Oscar had gone away to jail for his crimes because it hits the viewer over the head with the similarities between the two men. Oscar is white so he can bounce back from serving prison time for a white collar crime. Oscar, on the other hand, does no have that luxury as a black man as we have seen.
ReplyDeleteI absolutely agree with Jordan James’ comments about the fuzzy line that is drawn during situation like the one on the platform. The police can sometimes be stereotyped to not be real humans with real feelings, but instead carbon copies of the racist policemen during Jim Crow. This film blurs that line of fault by making Oscar’s drunk, adrenaline, and testosterone filled friends act really stupid in a time where they need to show respect and be calm. As we talked about in the sixth period class, this whole scene was a pissing contest between the police and the black men. It was a fight for power that they all came to without their decision-making frontal lobes intact.
I want to acknowledge both Yani and Jon for being great discussion partners throughout the year. Sometimes in our class it feels like us three just kind of go back and forth, but I feel that we all get some type of deeper understanding from the conversations. We don’t always agree on everything, but we do always have a very healthy respect for what somebody else is saying in the discussions.
1. I think that Peter symbolizes what Oscar’s future could be, at least if he were white. Peter was once in a similar situation, he was broke but he still managed to tie the knot. Peter is not proud of stealing and scamming, just like how Oscar does not like selling weed and showing up to work late, but is ready to settle down with his girlfriend and get his life back on track. However, Oscar gets caught up in a stupid tussle and loses everything. We can get caught up in saying “what if,” but so we can for Freddie Gray, Trayvon Martin, and everyone else.
ReplyDelete2. The dehumanization of “other” people can only go so far, we have to realize that people so different from us and so detached from our lives have the same rights as we do. We see the cop’s humanity in this moment, even though it takes a struggling, dying man to see it. I’ll admit that my first though was that the cop was concerned about liability or backlash, but I soon realized that he actually felt a horrible shame, perhaps something like you or I have never felt before. Perhaps there is a little bit of the cop in us, too. We are quick to demonize other people far removed from us: rural folks, homeless people, poor whites and blacks alike¬–we forget that there’s more than just one narrative going on under our skin. John Newton, an officer on a slave ship, wrote the poem “Amazing Grace” after realizing all of the cruel stuff he had done. It is impossible to change the past, but perhaps we can do our best to treat everyone well in our present.
3. Shoutout to Liam G. I enjoy talking to him, I feel that he gives a very honest perspective on these issues and often provokes my though or challenges doctrine or ideas that I may have bought into.
)This scene was important to the film because it showed many examples of opportunities that would never come for Oscar. Oscar throughout the film is painted as slightly forgetful and short sighted, but in this conversation with Peter we are able to see that he is thinking of a future with Sophina and their daughter. I like the way they did it in the movie more than the screen play. In the screen play it sounds very forced, kind of like the directors are like “here’s someone super similar to Oscar, and could be Oscar in ten years if he didn’t die.”
ReplyDelete2) This scene is almost too chaotic to try and assign blame further than the obvious. It all started out as a small interaction between two people who met while buying fish and ended with someone getting shot. This goes to show how things can escalate quickly when people aren’t properly trained. Police officers should know what to do in situations that they are unsure of rather than immediately going to aggression as a way to de escalate situations. We don’t even know why the initial fight was started--given that the two men have had a tense relationship for years.
3) I really appreciate how everything that Marie said this semester was very thought out. She was very good at articulating what she was trying to say and making wonderful and clear points. I also appreciated the positive vibes Zoya brought to class. She was always willing to dive into a conversation and share her thoughts and ideas.
^^It's Lila, I accidentally published it on my moms email.
Delete1. I think this conversation is important because it shows that these are just two men having a conversation, discussing marriage and legal troubles, and just connecting without race being a limiting or even a contributing factor. What I thought was really interesting, and even though others have mentioned this, is that in the movie, Peter never mentions having gone to jail whilst this comes up in the script. I think this is important because in the movie it just seemed more casual and as though Peter faced no repercussions for his actions. Also important is that this exchange shows that Oscar loves Sophina and wants to spend his life with her rather than feeling obligated to stick around. We also see that he wants to give his family a better life.
ReplyDelete2. I think it is very difficult to say why this happened because nobody but that officer can really know for sure. As far as I'm concerned, the "gun mistaken for taser" defense is bogus as police officers receive plenty of training and are expected to become very familiar with their weapons and equipment to prevent something like this from ever happening. Maybe he wasn't thinking, or maybe he was tired and aggravated but nobody can really know for sure. The short of it is that it shouldn't have happened by any account. There is no good or logical explanation for the murder of this innocent, unarmed man. I agree with what Jordan said and when you have two groups of people who feel fundamentally opposed to each other, bad things can happen. Murder, however, is not something that should ever come out of these altercations, especially at the hands of those who are sworn to protect us.
3. Jordyn, just being in the same room as you brightens my day. You are one of the brightest, sweetest, and most thoughtful people I've ever met. You always have a kind word and a smile for everyone and just having a conversation with you reveals how wise and knowledgable you are. You bring so much to our discussions and I feel so lucky to know you and to be able to call you my friend. I hope we have more classes together next year because I know that I will get more out of them because of you.
1. I believe the director placed this scene in the film for multiple reasons. The first one being that he wanted to remind the audience that Oscar has a future beyond what is happening in his life at the moment, which makes his character feel more real. This reminder of how young and how much potential Oscar had makes his death that more upsetting to me. I believe the director also placed it in this scene to make Oscar's story feel more universal. This man's story is that he stole and conned people for money and then got his life together and started business. This made me think "hey that could be Oscar in a few years", but no. His life was taken from him.
ReplyDelete2. I would like to think that that officer really did just mistake his taser for his gun. When in a situation like that and an officer is on such high alert, I find it very unlikely that he would make an error such as that. I find it almost repulsive that a man would quantify someone's death into a mere mistake that should be forgiven. He doesn't care about Oscar or that he's died. He only cares about himself and getting out of this situation. I completely agree with Jordyn in that this new form of racism is completely silent. It isn't about what people say anymore, it's about their actions and how they cary themselves.
3. I would like to thank Jacobi for his points and his sense of humor. I think talking and discussing books and films in class should feel like a regular conversation, rather than an academic discussion. Jacobi has always done a great job of keeping the conversation lively and interesting and has made the class more enjoyable for it. Although we talk about some very pressing topics, Jacobi always seems to put the room with ease with his very articulate points. I appreciate him.
I think this scene is here for perspective. It shows Oscar’s character and his lack of prejudice. In some places there’s a stigma that some black people surround themselves with only other black people, and won’t interact with white people. This scene, along with the market scene, shows that Oscar is not angry at white people, and while he is aware of racial status and the social effects it has on his community, he doesn’t see people by their race, and is not the “angry black guy” as Jordyn said. The film poses the idea that both Peter and Oscar have needed to turn to crime in order to support themselves and their families, but Peter did not do time for his crimes, whereas Oscar did. I think what Andrew said was really interesting because when you think of success in this country, many people think of rich white men, not about jail time, like the screenplay presents
ReplyDeleteI think this happened because of the multiple stigmas around black men and police officers and the pre manufactured tension between them because of that. There are a lot of building and spiraling emotions within the parties involved. Oscar and his friends are clearly angry and fed up with the treatment they and people who look like them are getting from police officers, no one is going to react positively to the treatment. I mostly blame the stigmas and emotions had by the officers. It’s a scary situation for both Oscar and the police officers, but the officers have the guns, the tazers, the power, and law enforcement behind them. They should be able to manage their emotions and their tactics to safely handle the situation, instead of killing a man because they couldn't grab his wrists
I appreciate Jordyn and Jordan for being so outspoken in our discussion about whether or not the class would say the “n” word in class. It’s a very touchy subject and sometimes black people wanting other people to say it can come off wrong, but they carried themselves and spoke about it really well, which helped me to talk about my opinions on the issue.